>>>>>>><
>From one of my friends I heared some stories saying that those stones are just formations resulted from oil and body juices mix. >Knowing very little about this sort of chemical tricks I thought that this may be the truth, cause my stones were mainly green and soft.
>But my second clense proved that those were just stories otherwise I would have got the same amount of stones of the same size.
>>>>>>>>><<<<
Hi, I was wondering about this very thing as well. Here is what i found that kind of goes against the liver purge. Tell me what you think. Thanks!
"People who have gallstones, or think they have gallstones, are invited to "flush" them out by swallowing a concoction of 1/2 cup of olive oil, a big grapefruit, 4 tablespoons of Epsom Salts , and three cups of water.
It was a nice idea, and interesting things will appear in the toilet bowl soon after. But I'm afraid that they're not your gallstones. Here's why:
Real Gallstones are faceted polyhedra, like the ones in the picture on the links below, or else shaped like mulberries. What you'll get from the recipe are spheres. One of my correspondents describes a friend who saves the spheres and displayed them to his friends.
Real gallstones hurt bad when they pass through the cystic and common bile ducts.
Real gallstones sink in water. (As an autopsy pathologist, I'm very familiar with this.) The "gallstones" you'll produce from this recipe will float, as the "alternative thinkers" themselves point out. (They claim that real gallstones float, too. Liars.)
If you know a little basic chemistry, you'll realize what is happening. The Epsom salts are magnesium sulfate, and the grapefruit contains some complex carbohydrates. When these slosh around in the stomach and small intestine, they'll form a tough film which will encase drops of olive oil. This will produce some yellowish balls which will float in the toilet.
Hulda Regehr Clark, the author of "The Cure for all Cancers" and "The Cure For HIV/AIDS" promotes this. Since she claims to have both a doctorate in naturopathy and a Ph.D. in something (the latter implying having done substantial original lab research), one would think she would have made an experiment with a real gallstone and discovered that it sinks. There's a nice photo which she took from my friend, pathologist Ed Klatt. She calls them "such small stones" though they're obviously 7-10 mm across. She thinks the stones she displayed formed in the liver and "rolled" into the gallbladder, which is silly. She says gallstones "can be of any color" which is a hoot. She also claims that the major cause of gallstones is wearing shoes.
If you want to believe these people, that is your business. If you try the purge, please chew your grapefruit up thoroughly. Otherwise, you're asking for a gastic bezoar and a trip to the endoscopist to remove the obstruction.
Gallstone cleansing
Gallstone Flush from Hulda Regehr Clark. Much of the material on these sites is identical though it's not clear who has borrowed from who."
Points brought up as a defense to the liver purge... if the liver purge is just a mixture to get these "gall stones" to appear on your stools, then how come you can get to a point where no more "stones" come out? Also, "judge by results" as they say.
However, i'd like to get a definite answer on whether or not the liver purge IS doing what it claims...and not just another placebo pill.
Legal action should be taken against MD'S for killing their patients and making money off of them. Legal action should be taken against MD'S because they prefer you not be "cured" so they and the big pharma can make tons of money off our stupidity!! I just joined and I have taken my own gallbladdr flush AND IT WORKS.!!! I have not read the entire recipe that this website suggests but I will send my recipe if anyone wants it. It took OVERNIGHT to get my Gallstones out. I am not computer savvy but will try and post a pic I took of my stones if anyone is interested.
Halime
>
> "People who have gallstones, or think they have gallstones, are
> invited to "flush" them out by swallowing a concoction of 1/2 cup
> of olive oil, a big grapefruit, 4 tablespoons of Epsom Salts , and
> three cups of water.
This kind of simplification demonstrates a lack of understanding of what's going on. You've listed the ingredients, but you've completely lost the technique. More comments you (or the author of this attack) make further demonstrate a lack of understanding of the technique.
> Real Gallstones are faceted polyhedra, like the ones in the
> picture on the links below, or else shaped like mulberries. What
> you'll get from the recipe are spheres. One of my correspondents
> describes a friend who saves the spheres and displayed them to his
> friends.
As I've explained elsewhere, I passed gallstones during my gallstone attacks last year. I've also passed gallstones doing flushes. I was not drinking oil (in fact, I avoided fats like crazy) last year. I am definitely drinking oil this year. I'm seeing the same kinds of stones -- the same appearance, the same texture -- now as I did then -- plus other ones this year that I didn't pass then. Then hurt like hell. Now doesn't. It does kinda tickle... And I can feel when my liver or gallbladder goes into overdrive pushing out bile during a flush.
> Real gallstones hurt bad when they pass through the cystic and
> common bile ducts.
And on this point, we are in full agreement.
> Real gallstones sink in water. (As an autopsy pathologist, I'm
> very familiar with this.) The "gallstones" you'll produce from
> this recipe will float, as the "alternative thinkers" themselves
> point out. (They claim that real gallstones float, too. Liars.)
I dunno... the one's I've seen float, but then I've also found them embedded in feces (both last year and now), and so it's difficult to say whether or not they were floaters or sinkers.
It tends to depend on the composition of the stone, no? I've read *old* texts on gallstones which described them as having a variety of colors.
> If you know a little basic chemistry, you'll realize what is
> happening. The Epsom salts are magnesium sulfate, and the
> grapefruit contains some complex carbohydrates. When these slosh
> around in the stomach and small intestine, they'll form a tough
> film which will encase drops of olive oil. This will produce some
> yellowish balls which will float in the toilet.
Little yellowish balls... that scratch my ass on the way out? So then how do you explain the tan and green ones?
OK, let's, for the sake of argument, follow along this line. If you actually understood the technique, you would know that the epsom salts and the oils are not taken together. In fact, they're taken such that the epsom salts have passed through an *empty* stomach two hours before the oil is introduced. Therefore, the magnesium sulfate has already been absorbed into the tissues before the oil even hits the stomach and small intestine. The chance of a large volume of magnesium sulfate interacting with the oil is very, very small.
In this case, it isn't an understanding of chemistry which is needed, but merely the ability to follow directions.
It might be interesting, however, to throw all the ingredients you've mentioned into a mixing bowl and see what comes out.
> If you want to believe these people, that is your business. If you
> try the purge, please chew your grapefruit up thoroughly.
> Otherwise, you're asking for a gastic bezoar and a trip to the
> endoscopist to remove the obstruction.
I find this EXTREMELY amusing. If you had ONCE bothered to read Dr. Clark's materials or even ONCE attempted to understand them, you'd know that the grapefruit is JUICED. I'd really like to know how you juice a grapefruit such that you have to chew it.
Conclusion: you did a half-assed job of reading the material, decided that you "know best" and could "think you way through it" without once ever directly observing whether or not the TECHNIQUE worked, and then tried to pass off your "learned" opinion on others.
Hell, if you can't follow the simple instruction of juicing the grapefruit, it's highly unlikely that you could follow the entire procedure, and it's even more unlikely that you could be as expert in the operation of the human gallbladder as you purport to be.
One direct observation beats a thousand expert opinions.
There certainly has been some very good debate of late regarding the formation of bile stones. I can appreciate much regarding the points presented, but I just thought I'd drop a line regarding the way they form and why they form.
I must say, one of the more interesting points was regarding the stones forming with the use of an oil causing as much bile to be dumped into the intestines as possible and that they then form from the oil and bile mix as it passes towards the exit point. This is quite contradictory to what the bile actually does. It would be like saying that mixing gasoline with grease causes the grease to thicken into globs of grease.
However, this one article will pretty much explain quite a bit regarding bile. I especially like the note regarding proteins in the second paragraph of "What Causes Gallstones".
http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/950732863.html
Now as regards the formation of bile stones in the liver I thought this article would at least shed some light regarding its danger. But, I don't endorse this produce as I feel diet, exercise, and just plain common sense should help most people in dealing with bile stones of the liver, or gallbladder.
The fact that we, as humans, are all different and yet the same, can certainly effect the results of how a flush of the liver and gallbladder will turn out. Some of us have been subjected to various toxins earlier in life, or are being subjected to it on a daily basis today in the form of chemicals used for various forms of cleaning, the foods that we eat, or just from the air that we breath. Our skin is absorbing an amazing amount of toxins without our even knowing it. Some toxins can have a vary adverse effect pretty quickly as in the case of handling some chemicals like bug sprays that affect the brain when ingested from either the skin, nose, or mouth. The one organ that has to handle detoxifying of all these chemicals is the liver. It is the main organ of the body for input and output and the amount of input with everyone has been, and is at the present time, different. Therefore just on this basis alone we have differences of how an attempted cleansing of the liver or gallbladder is going to turn out. T
With myself I now look at seeing small Gallstones as a very positive effect of my diet, exercise, and flushing. My earlier examples in "99" have been noted by a pathologist as being gallstones, but they certainly were not small by any means.
As regards the formation of stones in the liver, it happens but it doesn't necessarily mean that all stones start forming in the liver and are then transported to the gallbladder to become larger. That can happen, but isn't quite as likely as it would be for them to form right there, inside the gallbladder itself. It isn't because of the removal of the water, and its becoming more concentrated, it has to do with the information presented earlier in this letter as noted from the website to which I'm pointing. It has to do with too much of one thing or another being in the bile causing a precipitation of either the calcium salts and bilirubin, or cholesterol. Looking at this picture you can see that some liver stones get pretty darn big.
http://dbs.kumc.edu/dmd/?MIvalObj=664
The simple fact that the removal of the water from the bile doesn't have an effect on the cause for precipitation of gallstones can be noted from the fact that you don't find any mention of that in any of the websites to which I can point, or anyone can find. It is like saying that a detergent becomes solid when it has an oil mixed in with it and all the water is removed, it just won't happen, it will be a concentrated soap containing oil or an oil containing a soap, i.e. detergent. I use a detergent to emulsify the grease and oil I get on my hands when working on a vehicle or other grease latten object. I can take that grease laden mix off my hand and leave it in the sun to attempt to dry but it won't. It will get thick again but with the addition of water it can certainly become an emulsive once again and wash off the platter on which it may have been placed.
I am very fortunate in that my success with the flushing, and continued maintenance of my liver has kept me in pretty good health, over all, and especially considering that I was bedridden in "95" for two months with CFS and arthritis tearing me up. So, I can't help but to be a proponent of the cleansing of the liver, gallbladder and colon as it has brought me to the health I am able to enjoy today. And like so many, I just wish I'd known what I do today when I was much younger so I wouldn't have to deal with the pains I've acquired and continue to acquire as this body ages to destruction. I can only hope that I can keep up maintaining away from the pain that I know is sitting just off to the side if I were to not keep up a healthy life style.
Hi everyone! I am doing by 7th (maybe 8th) flush tonight. I had to go to the bathroom after the 8:00 pm Epsom potion and there were 3 stones!! I guess this goes against the theory that the stones that come out are formed by the olive oil huh??
I will post my results tomorrow. I took almost a whole bottle of Gold Coin Grass during the past 2 weeks so I want to see if it makes a difference. I hope this flush is good!
Hi everyone! I have had a different flush then any of the other ones. After I took the Epsom Salts I passed about 4 stones about the size of 1/2 a pea. I could not believe it! I took the OO/Grapefruit juice and fell asleep. I did not wake up until almost 7:00 am! I could not believe it. I slept right thru. Anyway, I took the Epsom Salt potions twice this morning and I just now had a bowel movement. I usually can not get off the toliet starting from about 5:00 am for the rest of the day. I am not sure why I have only had really good BM today.. But it was a good one! I got about 8-10 about the size of 2 peas together out and TONS of little small ones.. they look broken up.. I think this might be from the Gold Coin Grass.. Anyway, I did not get the quantity (so far) that I have before but I got more big ones.. that is good right? I will keep you guys posted as the rest of the day goes on.
Deena : ) Who is VERY thankful she found this website 8 months ago!!
I've only done the flush 2 times about 2 months ago.
This morning I passed green, waxy and hard stones. All I've done differently for the last couple days is constantly drink lemon water, ate lots of raw parsley, couple doses of acidophilis, one P&B shake yesterday. I haven't had any olive oil or epsom salt.
Maybe they were sitting in my colon from the flushes two months ago and the lemon, parsley, probiotics flushed them out? I just don't know.
Actually, I was going to post on this very subject. On the 4th of July I ate nothing but chocolate chip cookie dough made from Butter Flavor Crisco. Disgusting, yes...but true. I was having very bad PMS, and preparing a large meal without any assistance. Well, I had no appetite for dinner, as you can probably guess why. I ate about 1/2 a hamburger without a bun. Within an hour, my gall bladder started acting up. No, I don't expect sympathy, I absolutely brought this on myself and I know that. At any rate, I was in the bathroom and had the familiar, pale clay colored stool and chaff (never having done a proper cleanse), and there was an ENORMOUS stone (1/2" in diameter) lodged on the outer portion of stool (I didn't get a stick or anything). There were smaller ones the next day all through the stool. I was shocked! How could this have happened? Just from having all that fat? I have to wonder.
BTW...olive oil CAN'T congeal at room temperature or above...that's why it's mostly polyunsaturated fat. Only saturated/animal fats "congeal" or solidify at room temperature. That's how you can tell the difference. So don't worry, it's not congealed olive oil.
Also, do a search for "beet" because one of the flushers on this forum did exactly what you mention: he dyed his flush so that he would be able to tell what was congealed and what wasn't.
Here's one on the age-old subject of "are they really stones, or are they olive oil?"
I found a college lab procedure in organic chemistry for extracting pure cholesterol from human gallstones. The Gallstones were to be dissoved first in organic solvent, and the resulting solution was supposed to turn black, due to the presence of bilirubin.
Following something someone else did and reported on this forum, I melted a few of my stones into little puddles on the stove, and they did indeed have the exact color of olive oil, like the other guy said. But I did something he didn't: I put some drops of olive oil next to them and turned up the heat. Here's what happened.
Burner (electric) on level 2 or 3: stones (cholesterol) start bubbling; olive oil just sits there.
Burner on level 4 or 5: stones boil and liquid turns black (from bilirubin??); olive oil just sits there.
Burner on level 6 or 7: stones boil furiously down to nothing, leaving dark black stains on the aluminum foil; olive oil just sits there.
Burner on level 9: black stains where stones used to be burst into flame and burn with an ordinary yellow-orange flame for about 10 seconds. The olive oil is still just sitting there, a perfect little puddle of olive-green liquid.
DesertRat, I just read about your little experiment with the stove and I think it's just great that you took the time and did it. I think we need more people that are very skeptical in the forum because they force us to do more research and study on our own, which improves our experience.
So I would encourage everyone in the forum not to take it personally ,when somebody is doubting the methods, as it helps us to understand the problem better and move to another level.
I learn a lot from all your answers so we need the questions.
Thank you.
Do not forget that you drank not just the pure olive oil, but the mixture of olive oil and the grapefruit/lemon juice and this concoction passed through the digestive tract where it was processed and transformed by your body. Therefore, your “stones” cannot react the same way as the pure olive oil when heated!!!!Would you expect to see the same result if you burn a hotdog and what's left from the hotdog you ate a couple of days ago?
there is a gallstone cleanse that you take ortho phosphoric acid lecthin stone breaker and malic acid to soften them then build bile pressure with artichoke and dandelion root on the day of the cleanse and do a coffee filled with magnesium then drink the oil mixture. Then you wait fifteen minutes and do breathing techniques then pump your liver then pump your gallbladder, i have felt them shoot out of my gallbladder on top of that i had thousand of them come out after one flush that i would have had to have like fifty times more oil and salt to make that many. But all the evidence you need is when you do it you pump them out and feel them going out. the one you are talking about does the same thing it is just a very very weak one.
If you http://www.google.com
images of Gallstones you will get the hard ones and the soft ones. I am not a chemist, just a layperson with 1/2 a brain (i hope) In my research of gallstones you have two types, the green cholesterol ones and the rock hard ones. The majority of people have the soft green ones. I also believe that if the olive oil is "making the green stones" then how come they eventually dissappear after doing 2 or more flushes? Doctors just want more money for unnecessary surgery. I am not wanting to make an argument here just my opinion.
Thanks.
I have my pic of my stones but do not know how to get in on this website. THEY ARE REAL.....lol...and after the second flush they were much, much smaller and after the third flush they WERE GONE!!
perhaps both things are happening here, i.e. we are getting false stones and real stones from gallbladder and/or liver...maybe? the ducts don't seem to be flacid and large enough for 1'' stones but smaller stones could get through...also can liver stones float even though Gallstones may not? I tried this flush out of curiosity and I found big green floaters and small blondish facited sinkers...I have kept some and will see if a lab can tell us what they are...until then...chaio!
holy smoke! I haven't sent the things to the lab yet but i just read an article in JRMS 2006 11(5):329-331 were an 8 cm x 5 cm gallstone was found in a man's small intestine! Alors! I take it back regarding the "one incher" being too big! He didn't even do anything particular to cause a contraction to remove.
I also just read an anti-flush article called "The Truth About Gallbladder and Liver "Flushes" and the author doesn't fully deny the mechanics of the flush (in fact he supports it)while "poo-poo-ing" it anyhow. He also fails to compare and contrast the medical drug used to dissolve stones with apple juice to dissolve stones. He says something like 'one works through the digestive pathway into the blood, via the blood to the liver/gallbladder while the other one doesn't work because it doesn't back up from the small intestine into the gallbladder'. Of course not! Hello! So, it's still "open" then that the apple juice could have something in it that travels the normal digestive pathway to the blood and the organs of discussion. How did this guy get through school?
The other problem with the essay is that it says 'fake stones don't hold up and turn to mush' (but in other words) and then discusses some sort of "sludge" that can be expelled from the gallbladder. What's the sludge? could it be a broken down stone or a "yet-to-be" stone, which if yes to one or both of these questions then why couldn't a stone out of the body being oxidized turn to mush? According to the jrms article only a small percentage of stones totally calcify (...and thus sink?...and thus hold-up?...since fat and emulisfiers like bile float on water? I don't know if bile floats do you?). Also, we haven't even talked about liver stones (...it's a liver and gallbladder flush by the way) and how they look, behave in air, water and the liver. I honestly don't know the answers to these questions or wether or not the flush is fake but if one is to argue one side or the other it sure would be refreshing if one could write a strong essay and then edit it for christ sake...
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Re: Liver stones or just some formations of oil mixed with body juices? R by Iris
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