People, animals and fish are souls. A body and the breath of life.
Rev. 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Think of the body as a light bulb and the breath of life (spirit) as electricity. When you have them both together, you have light. If you take away the electricity, you have a dead bulb. Where did the light go? It didn't go anywhere. It just ceases to exist.
God can put them back together any time He wants.
Isaiah 49:16 Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands; thy walls are continually before me.
John 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
1Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
your points are well taken. People, animals, and fish have souls, and are referred to as souls. It is more of the ambiguity of the Narrator. His purpose is to weed the garden. How can a soul die and go out upon a man's death? The Scripture also explains that the soul and the spirit can be divided by God.
However the 100000000 dollar question of the day is how it it that The Lord Himself descends with a shout, with the voice of The Arch Angel?????????????????????????????
Do you suppose that there are two of them, and the Lord shouts, and Michael speaks with his voice??? Or perhaps there is something to this nonsense I speak of???
A thought occurred to me as I reflected on your analogy. Electricity cannot be breathed. The electricity is your spirit. the shell of the bulb is your body, and the air within the bulb is your soul. When the death of the bulb occurs, the bulb is broken. As you may know, elecricity is energy and energy cannot be destroyed. It can only alter it's form. So the bulb is in a lamp that was energized, that someone knocked over. Animals are not spiritual, and therefore they do not possess a spirit. The lamp that they represent was not energized at the time of the mishap.
I've always been told that Michael was another name for Jesus before He became a man.
The word angel means messenger. Jesus had the most important message (highest).
So He would be our Archangel.
Rev. 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
Jude 9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses,...
Satan didn't want Moses to go to heaven but Jesus took him.
John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me though he were dead, yet shall he live:
Daniel 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
That's the second coming. Daniel was before Jesus was born and since he calls Michael "the great prince" I think Michael is the one we now know as Jesus.
Did you say hello for me when The Holy Spirit visited you? Well done man!!!
Jesus was indeed Michael, for a spiritual sacrifice also had to be fulfilled in order that all could be saved, according to the righteousness of His Father. Michael also became Jesus after he became a man!!!
A more accurate definition for angels can be had in the first chapter of Hebrews. They are ministering spirits sent to help those that are to inherit salvation. Ask a Jewto translate angel for you and you will see that it is son of God. Michael is the Holy {Head} of that {body} of holy angels, known to us as The Holy Spirit. They are the bride of the father, just as Christians become the bride of the Christ. The trinitarians have bits and pieces of it correct. For example they claim that the Holy Spirit is the power of God. Hebrews reveals exactly that. Can you see it???
Let us continue. Why didn't John the Baptist recognize his cousin as Messiah when He came to be baptized? John's mother knew! John's father knew! Do you think they would keep this from him? When Mary came to visit the family, the fetus leaped within her, and it was no spasm.
Welcome to the light my brother. You see, I knew I could count on you. Wink wink
Keep on seeking and you will find. Keep on knocking and the door will be opened.
It is far more difficult for the learned Christian to open the door because they insist on keeping it locked, and thus not allowing Satan out. These poor children don't know that their sick. Most are offended by me. Reread all the posts and tell me this is justified. They have become the Jews of Jesus' day. They have hardened hearts and therefore do not recognize the Word of God. Find a single statement I have offered and disprove it reasonably. I welcome your scrutiny because if someone with your formidable work can find a flaw then we both receive a greater understanding. If not then you are in for one huge rush dude, let me tell you. I get a massive chill when I receive true knowledge. I don't know if it is the same with everyone.
Anyway, sleep well you will need your strength. Blessing Mr. Steve
Have you made any headway? Or do you need more time. Leave the others to their pomp. There is nothing that can be done for them just yet. If they are children of God,His word will call on them, just as it has called upon you. Do you understand now? Pertaining to my previous explanation of the hardened heart. Those suffering from that condition, are unaware of it. They think that the warnings pertain to unbelievers. All warnings from the Scriptures are directed at those who read The Word after all. If one does not read it, one does not receive the warning.
Assume for a moment, that all I have shared thus far is true. It must be Biblically supported correct??? If Jesus was the Arch Angel Michael, and head of The Holy Spirit, then there must be Scripture to support it.
Have a look at the Baptism of Jesus. John knew his cousin, and in fact he knew that his cousin was The Chosen One. So why did he not recognize Him when he requested a baptism?
The answer is that The Spirit of The Christ had not entered into Jesus as of yet.
So what did John get for his confirmation?
He witnessed The Holy Spirit, in the form of a dove, descend upon Him, RIGHT??? How cool is that????????? If you shold require more Biblical suport, look anywhere, as it is supported everytime. My particular favorite is in the first chapter of Hebrews.
Review it and share it with us all.
This was the moment when Michael's Spirit entered into the body and soul of the man called Jesus. This was when the ministry of The Christ Jesus began.
Sorry for the overload, but I'm guessing that you can handle it.
I will leave you with this question.
Why is a man, who is without sin, requesting a baptism of repentance? or for that matter, assuming that this is all in fact true, Why on Earth would the Arch Angel ask for the same???
Alright so I had two questions. So sue me! Luv ya bud, Mr. Steve
>This was the moment when Michael's Spirit entered into the body and soul of the man called Jesus. This was when the ministry of The Christ Jesus began.
Wrong. Michael is the archangel who still lives. Jesus is Jesus(Christ). They are not the same people, and Michael's spirit did not go into Jesus. Even in the book of Revelation it says when the rapture comes, the ArchAngel, which is Michael, will sound the trumpet. Jesus will take us up with Him.
I hope I have given you more understanding about Jesus Christ and His Word, and I pray you see His Light.
You have either refused or found yourself unable to support your previous statements. Are you aware of the fact that you do not support your conclusions, through the study of Scripture?
If you are so certain of your understanding, then why is it that you don't show a misguided brother the error of his ways???
You have the benefit of the freinds you have, that surround you in this forum. Perhaps you could inquire of them to aid you in your efforts???
Is my request so unreasonable?
You are correct in that I speak nonsense. This is because your faith lies with your Church, from whence it came. The Word implicitly teaches us to have faith in The Word of God, first and foremost. That faith that you acquired through the deeds of your efforts, ensure you a seat in The Kingdom of Heaven on Earth. If you should find yourself in a false christian Church, your reward will be small. Also, you will not be raptured along with the True Church. When the rapture occurs at the last trumpet, this truth will be revealed immediately to every believer on the planet.
If you cannot grasp the symbolism of dust, or even find it for that matter, then may I suggest that you read The Word of God So that you may reassess your fordrawn conclusion that my offeriis nonsense. The fact that you remain involved reveals that you are divided, does it not??? If there is no one to help you, then ask your questions and I will offer you my help, to the best of my ability. You are in studious company after all so there can't possibly be in any harm.
It's one or the other, numbers. Offer or ask. Shouting out NONSENSE!!! when it is not supported with reason is NONSENSE!!!
>He was the first perfect homosapian to be called Man by God, as Adam was made perfect, in comparison to imperfect homosapians that preexisted him. Science has again nailed it.
Maybe Adam was one of the first homosapien, neolithic men. Assuming evolution is untrue, that we don't come from monkeys, then the first man was a person with emotions, and needs, like us modern men. Therefore, no science hasn't really nailed anything. Adam was possibly one of those cavemen, or neolithic men.
>Dust is a designation for non spiritual Man.
Where do you get this stuff from? That's makes no real sense. Dust is not symbolic of really anything. Rice is symbolic of fertility. Dust is not symbolic of anything. So you extrapolate on nonsense. Your whole argument is nonsense.
First you say Adam was not perfect b/c he came from dust, then you say God made him perfect after God made him from the dust. Which is it? Was Adam imperfect or not?
God righteousness has always been there. It doesn't have to be fulfilled. God is pure, good, loving, merciful, light, etc.
What Bible do you read? You just seem like you make things up as you go.
I will pray that God gives you enlightenment on these many things about Him that you need understanding on.
Thank you for addressing me. Perfect man is spiritual, just as angels are more perfect beings than are we. Perfect Man is a little lower than the angels. Adam's perfection was made possible by the intoduction of the spirit into his being.
"Let {us} create Man in {Our} image, in {our} likeness" is vastly different from "God made Man in {His} image, in the image of {God} He created him; male and female He created them". Who is us??? who is our??? Why the discrepancy??? Why the redundancy???
They are two different events. Science did in fact nail it, because they {we} figured out that modern man existed long before the Bible says Adam was bumped from the garden. It will have been exactly 6000 years, to the day on the spring solstice of 2008. It is derived from the Biblical Hebrew calander, as opposed to the gregorian calander that we all use. In the Hebrew way, the night preceeds the day, as Genesis will confirm. The correct way to deduce when a day begins, is to follow the Hebrew way. The day begins at 6:00 p.m. First the darkness and then the light. First the physical and then the spiritual. First the corruptable and then the incorruptable. First Satan and then Jesus.
You don't really think that God is going to recreate you into an angel, or spirit being, just because you decided to get water baptized, do you??? We must earn our perfection, with God's help! Water baptism is just the first step. we are asking for His help in guiding us toward that goal. The water baptized still continuing sinning, right??? so where is the lesson in that??? Adam was the introduction of The Spirit into man's consciousness.
You will notice that the Scriptures state, "The Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to work it and take care of it". If He "took the man" and then placed him in the Garden, where did He take him from??? The Lord God breathed the breath of "spiritual" life into the man. Just as Physical Man is given the gift of Life freely, Adam was given the gift of spiritual life, freely. Of course he managed to blow it, just as we, his sons do, regardless of water baptism.
Do you think it a coincidence that the first woman, who was deceived, and created from the one of twelve ribs, of the man, happens to coincide with the twelve apostles and Judas??? Or perhaps it is is also a coincidence that Man requires one third, or eight hours of sleep,{in the darkness}, and one third of the body of Holy angels fell into that same darkness.
You still don't see??? As I covered earlier, with my brother Beej, the water baptism of John was a cleansing of past sin. What did God do to the nephilim??? He cleansed the world of it's past sin, didn't He??? But the world became filthy again didn't it. So there is a further baptism, a baptism of blood. It is today commonly called Armeggedon. But wait!!! There is more. What occurred on the Cross of The Christ??? His side was pierced, and what ensued??? The water and the blood. For that matter, what occurs when a new soul is brought forth??? First the womans water breaks, and then the blood, followed by the entrance of a new creation. Praise be to God.
So rice is symbolic of something is it??? Would you care to share a Scriptural verse to support that wisdom? Being as it is, that you have such a profound knowledge of the God of your worship. I have been judged for offering nonsense by you. Have the Scriptures not been fulfilled??? "Judge not, lest you yourself be judged" The dead see the Word of God as nonsense. Bring your heart into it's right condition, that you may see. The Great Day of The Lord is at the door, which is your heart, for anyone that may still suspect that I have come from God, at His request.
I have many Bibles, however my most informative of the lot are the Greek and Hebrew Interlinear, as it is Our Lord did not choose to speak with us in the language we currently employ.
Christian love to you, Mr. Steve
Actually no. I have never recieved any knowledge from a J.W. I am however aware that there is some research that agrees with my understanding, as I stated in the clever secret place recently. Perhaps we could make more headway if you were to disclose the basis of your understanding, that I may scrutinize it. I'm guessing you to be a trinitiarian. If that is in fact the case would you care to disclose which version you have decided on? There are two of which I am acquainted. Assume that I have a reasonable understanding of the teaching. I was raised a Catholic, but I will not inquire as to your choice. what's good for the goose is good for the gander after all. I am not a liar Rodney
Your comments that infer I am a liar are in the conclusion you have drawn with regard to my offensive secret religion, being that of the Jehovah's witnesses.
Charles Taze Russel was the founder of the International Bible Students, as a religion. If my memory serves me. They went on to become the J.W.s.
I am not a liar, and I am not a fool. I was merely addressing your spirit, and stating the truth in the matter for the record. As to your request? So let it be m brother in Christ.
this could, and no dought will be debated till Jesus comes.
myself i believe the Gospel of Jesus Christ,God manifested in the flesh,His Death,and His glories resurrection.
The Church was warned about such teachings 2,000 years ago.
read the Bible and believe, its good for the SOUL.
Col 2:18 - Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
He disputes against the first type of corruptions, and sets down the worshipping of angels as an example: which type of false religion he refutes, first, this way: because those who bring in such a worship, attribute that to themselves which is proper only to God, that is, authority to bind men's consciences with religion, even though they seem to bring in these things by humility of mind.
By foolish humility of mind: for otherwise humility is a virtue. For these angel worshippers blamed those of pride who would go straight to God, and use no other means besides Christ.
Secondly, because they rashly thrust upon them as oracles those things which they neither saw nor heard, but devised by themselves.
Thirdly, because these things have no other ground upon which they are built, but only the opinion of men, who please themselves immensely in their own devices.
I do not worship an angel. Reread my posts. I have given you the truth, that the one you know as Jesus WAS an angel, and is in fact our Father, who is a mighty God. His Father is also our Father. He is The Almighty God, Our GRANDFATHER, if you will.
What you are not able to see, is that there is an element of time that must be injected into your reasoning. For example, when ever the number seven is utilized, the text being referred to is to be viewed chronologically.
Anyone that would kill Cain was to be suffer vengence by God seven times over. This refers to a period of time.
Thanks is not necessary in this matter. We are brothers. Your apology was however necessary, though for your benefit, not mine. You have proven yourself worthy.
I am well aware of your belief system. I use the word system with regard to the process you employ, with which you draw your personal conclusions. I am here to offer you an objective observation of that process, that you may examine yourself so as to be sure that you are acting in your best interests.
Your knowledge of Scripture is apparent. So this should give you the confidence to confront Satan if he just happens to be lurking about. If you are willing, then I propose that we reprove the trinity doctrine.
If you would like to begin by invoking the relevant Scriptures that support your thesis, then do so, and then explain your reasoning that supports your thesis. I have not come to embarrass anyone, but rather to enlighten. After each point has been offered and then reasoned, then allow my rebuttal. We will then move on to the next point you wish to address.
To be completely fair, so as to prevent any embarrassing descent among your peers, I extend my offer to all who share your view in this exercise.
After your party has had your say, and rests your case, each participant declaring the same, then in fairness to me, I will invoke relevant Scriptures against your case, and explain my reasoning as to why I believe the thesis to be incorrect, at which time, in the same manner, your rebuttles will be heard.
If you refuse, then you will have laid yourself{selves} bare, and I will be on my Way. I would prefer that your understanding{s} increase. Whichever choice you make it is my hope that you will all hold on dearly to what little you have, as the price for our ignorance is high. Our God after all exacts perfect justice.
>First the physical and then the spiritual. First the corruptable and then the incorruptable. First Satan and then Jesus.
Assuming you are right about the Hebrew calendar, then the above statement that you said is arbitrary. Who says first the physical, etc. Now your whole argument is nonsense.
BTW, you seem to have skirted the issue of symbolism. A man with obvious knowledge who seems to know(seems to think he knows) everything, you know the rice is a symbol of fertility, and dust is not. Dust is not symbolic of anything, yet you fabricated a whole argument around such mess. It was complete nonsense. And you have no recourse b/c you know you are wrong.
You need to recognize the real True God, the God of Jacob, who is the Most High, the Almighty, and he will heal your mind.
If I recall, I asked you to produce a Scripture that supports your rice symbolism. You have as of yet refused to do so or have found yourself unable to do so. I will put that on the back burner for now as it is a very big Book. If you begin in the New Testament you will however stumble into the symbolism of dust. I will give you a clue though to speed you on your journey. Our Lord Himself uttered the words to His apostles. Good luck. Incidentally, I have a good feeling about you.
Hi: Mr. Steve
i am truely sorry if i insinuated that you were a lier, i don't remember doing so. but if you thought so, its as bad as me doing so, forgive me.
GOD BLESS YOU .
Symbolism is "in its simplest terms, a symbol is anything that stands for or represents something else beyond it."(http://www.symbolism.org/writing/books/sp/1/page2.html)
Rice is a symbol of fertility, and as such rice is traditionally thrown at the bride and groom at weddings so they will have children. I don't know if that symbolism is in the Bible, but it is definitely a part of traditional Western culture.
Purple is a symbol of royalty, and as such in many stories, including biblical ones, a king's or queen's robe is purple.
The dust that is in the NT is when Jesus told His disciples to wipe the dust off their feet if they encountered people, or an area, that did not want to hear about His teachings. However, that is not symbolism. Dust doesn't mean anything but dust.
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