Corrections & thinks/thoughts... Re: Probiotics, AND...Re: I think this is die-off, but not sure- also question about ordering, thx:)

Howdy folks -

There's a bit of questionable information and definitely some misinformation in the post above (pasted below).   Somethings we all need to keep in mind: 1) is that everything we read isn't true (even when it comes from "alternative medicine") 2) Uny-me does have to 'police the forum' to reduce/eliminate misinformation to make sure that people aren't hurt by it (and this reduces the time I can spend answering posts).  So y'all can be assured, this is not something I "like" to do :(

I just want to share my own experience with probiotics. Sharing experiences is always a good thing!

Probiotics are of course vital to introduce at some point Actually, introducing healthy & natural (necessary) microbiota into the intestinal tract is something that is always "vital".  As whether or not the conditions are right for them to recolonize...well, they always assist in helping the conditions TO be right to for them to recolonize (although they need all the help we can give them, for sure).

while doing some cleansing that will also temporary kill the beneficial flora. To my knowledge, there's no aspect of the cleansing protocols we use here than will 'temporarily kill' beneficial flora.  Salt water flushes and taking Epsom Salts definitely (harshly) 'flushes out' many organisms, but we don't use those.  It's possible that some of the parasite/herbs kill microorganisms - but there are many variables at play there (and we should all be ingesting fermented foods/juices and kefirs, etc., to keep everything as balanced as possible).

But I would say, be VERY careful when you introduce them. Choose the right moment.  The "right moment" for ensuring that our intestinal tract has the beneficial microorganisms that our entire body is dependant upon it having...?...is always "now".  Yes, sometimes we need to introduce them slowly so we don't cause 'symptoms'.

Too early can have devastated consequences on someone. I disagree virtually 100%, giving our body something it lacks (it the form that is natural to the body), does not produce "devastating consequences". Introducing them too quickly can cause cramping and diarrhea, but that's not a devastating consequence - it's just an expected side-effect of 'going to fast'.

With a leaky gut (which all people have if they have any degree of sickness) and very compromised organs of detoxification (liver, kidneys)... I disagree 100%  - not everyone that has 'some degree of sickness' has leaky gut!!!  How in the world do people come up with ridiculous generalizations like that?

the result can be dramatic: most of the bacteria, even "healthy", will leak through that gut and invade the bloodstream, giving a even harder time to the organs.  It is "said" that in leaky gut, bacteria can leak into the bloodstream...but that (of course) depends upon the size of the 'holes' and the size of the bacteria.  The slippery elm & marshmallow in the IF#2 help to reduce inflamtion AND permeability (with the mucilage they produce).

  The main reason for leaky gut is the imbalance of microbiota, so restoring them is KEY to healing leaky gut. 

Your statement that "most of bacteria...will leak through that gut" is totally incorrect.  We have several POUNDS of bacteria in our digestive tract - if "most" leaked through, we'd be dead!

Many people see temporary bad reactions to probiotics as "die off", but it is often mistaken for the fact that the blood gets even more poisoned by bacteria. Poisoned by the beneficial flora? I'd like to see some evidence of this. "These bacteria help repair the intestinal wall and have been shown in numerous studies to reduce inflammation and repair leaky gut" And you are stating "as if it were a fact" that ingesting beneficial microorganisms in their natural form can poison our blood (causing adverse symptoms or harm).  I've never heard of this - so please post valid information that shows/lists the various types of beneficial flora that have been shown to enter the bloodstream due to leaky gut and what the adverse effects are.  Until that information is provided and examined, I ask you to please stop posting about 'leaky gut issues', because so far, the majority of the information you've posted seems incorrect to me.  

Of course, as some probiotics have also some anti bacterial effects, it could make things worth at first and then rebalance and help the whole body functionning better with a healthier flora, but it is very unlikely to happen to a very sick person (with a very bad case of leaky gut). If I'm understanding correctly, you're saying that in someone with a very bad case of leaky gut, replenishing the gut flora is unlikely to rebalance the flora (and it will make things worse).  Again, evidence please.  I'm always MORE than happy to learn and 'stand corrected'  (especially when learning replaces incorrect information with truth).  

So, my advice would be, if you're not too sick, introduce them while you're cleansing it could be just fine. If you're quite or very sick, WAIT for the stage that you've cleansed your organs of detoxification very well, and introduce L-glutamine or drink/eak a lot of cabbage juice (which is why cabbage is said to be very beneficial to the gut) to nourish the enterocytes of the gut and make them tighten first. Then the probiotics will be able to establish itself. Kcirla, I think you know we don't suggest/use isolated supplements like L-glutamine on this forum.  Yes, cabbage, cabbage juice & sauerkraut/juice are very beneficial, for many different reasons.

That's probably why sauerkraut is the best probiotic food I think, you've got the glutamine and the probiotics all at once. I believe a blend of various foods & liquids is best.  And the salt in sauerkraut can easily induce diarrhea.  And of course, inducing diarrhea in someone with leaky gut is never a goodness.

Kcirla (and everyone) - I appreciate people reaching out to help each other here (and I know "intentions are good").  But the fact remains, that incorrect information has great potential to cause harm, and we're not helping anybody if we cause harm. 

Uny

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