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Expanded All Messages [1290] Posted by natway, Sorted by Date Source: Mosaic: Messages Across All CureZone Forums & Blogs

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All Messages [1290] Posted by natway, Sorted by Date   Back To Standard Forum View

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  • Re: Natway, anorexia symptoms   by natway  116m   20  Adrenal Debate
     
    Maybe we should start with what are all the agreed upon symptoms of so-called ”AF”?   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  120m   12  Adrenal Debate
     
    Yes, convention med can prove both Cushing’s and Addison’s and ”AF” is supposedly closer to Addison’s, but as you say somewhat in between, but I still can’t believe with all the technology today that if ”AF” was real they can’t scientifically prove that. ... ... My point about alt med being very prosperous is there should be no reason alt med schools don’t have the resourced to prove ”AF”. Alt medicine will be taken much more serious if they can scientifically prove the conditions they believe in. ... ... ... ”This is what I was trying to say earlier...There’s no need to diagnose a new illness...ju ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3h   11  Adrenal Debate
     
    I meant it wasn’t the most comprehensible list. Go look at the link I posted and at the bottom you can see all the sources I used for my collection of starvation symptoms.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3h   13  Adrenal Debate
     
    I think that wasn’t the best list you found. ... ... In my thread about ”   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3h   24  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”let’s not call it a debate, because that just invites arguments. Let’s call it an exchange of ideas.” ... ... Sounds good! ... ... ... ”You pointed out a few articles that indicate chronic low caloric intake can lead to the General Adaptation Syndrome. ... I am glad you flagged this stressor. I had never thought of it as a potential stressor. People on the other forum are often unaware of all the stressors they expose themselves to” ... ... Well this is why I’ve been shouting from the rooftops about calorie-restriction (C-R), because C-R by itself matched all the symptoms of ”AF”, I noticed a lot of people ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4h   13  Adrenal Debate
     
    I see what you’re saying, but the reason most gravitate toward alt med is for the very reason you describe, their MD doctors can’t find anything physically wrong so they prescribe them psych meds or refer them to a psychiatrist and people get feed up with feeling their docs think it’s all in their head, so they decide to give alt med a try. ... ... But saying AMA wouldn’t follow alt med, well if ”AF” is a $100 million a year industry, I think the AMA will put their pride aside. I mean MD’s in the last couple of decades have been more receptive in using herbs becomes they’ve been losing so many ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: Dr. Lam proves my theory that AF is really under-eating   by natway  25h   20  Adrenal Debate
     
    I didn’t mean to sound like never eat high-fat foods. I meant to keep them down to a minimum. I eat avocados and nuts & seeds, just not in large quantity.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  25h   18  Adrenal Debate
     
    I agree that the medically community rather treat diseases rather than cure them, but in order to treat them the disease has to be scientifically proven. If they can prove the condition of Cushing’s, I see no reason they couldn’t prove the existence of ”AF” if it were real. I see no reason they wouldn’t want that to be a real disease so they can start charging people to treat it. ... ... Do you really think the AMA and big pharma wants alternative medicine to have the monopoly in treating a disease? No way!   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  25h   17  Adrenal Debate
     
    I’ve looked at dozens of people’s post histories in the AF section and talked to dozens more and pretty much you were the only one who didn’t seem to have a history of calorie-restriction. ... ... ... ”I have not read this (havent’t looked for it either), can you point me in the direction of this? ” ... ... The symptoms of starvation and so-called ”AF”: ... ... http://curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2045586 ... ... Though I have no idea who came up with the symptoms of so-called ”AF”. Do you know who did? Was it that naturopath James Wilson? ... ... ... ”Please elaborate because I’m not following your logic that unde ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  25h   23  Adrenal Debate
     
    I don’t have toxic hunger any more. Cured it a long time ago within a week of just changing my diet. Don’t take supps anymore either, except for Vit D. Hope that is not a source of jealousy.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  28h   16  Adrenal Debate
     
    The theory of ”AF” is the adrenals ”gas out” after prolonged elevated hormone production, so that would mean Cushing’s syndrome would be short-lived because people’s adrenals would ”gas out” before Cushing’s would kill them.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  28h   16  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Who’s ”almost everyone” and maybe.” ... ... Looking back a lots of people’s post history and talking to them about what they eat or used to eat, I just started finding that almost everyone in the AF section has or had some type of calorie-restriction history. Like I would say easily 90%. ... ... ... ”So when you couple an under-eating stress with...you may end up exhausted. ” ... ... Lots of things can cause exhaustion, but my whole point about prolonged under-eating is it causes the very same symptoms as listed for ”AF”. Not all the other things that cause exhaustion would case all the same symptoms li ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  28h   25  Adrenal Debate
     
    Hi Wired! Did you come to troll again with your anonymous #? ... ... ”that can be treated by his supplement protocols called ’Toxic Hunger’.” ... ... No supplements needed to cure. Just a change in diet, exactly how he described. ... ... How long have you been trying to cure your so-called ”AF” with the recommended ”AF” protocols? I cured my ”toxic hunger” within a week with just by diet. ... ... ... ”one poster who denies that the real medical condition of AF/GAS” ... ... I didn’t know AF was a real medical condition. I didn’t know G.A.S. was technically a medical condition either. What’s some of the protocols ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  29h   10  Adrenal Debate
     
    How fast do people die from Cushing’s? I see no where that people die rather quickly from it, so seems people would live long enough to where, according to the theory of ”AF”, their adrenals would ”gas out” before they died. ”AF” would affectively ”prevent” Cushing’s.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  29h   14  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Well why don’t we just put a cautionary note on every board about under-eating? Because is its impractical and likely not the cause of the problem.” ... ... I’m talking about if some condition was remarkably similar in symptoms of another condition, wouldn’t it be prudent to put a notice up to alert people of this to help avoid people misdiagnosing themselves? ... ... ... ”Your definitions of starvation and calorie restriction blur.” ... ... When I say calorie-restriction, I mean prolonged calorie-restriction that causes starvation. ... ... ... ”you may want to also warn them about refeeding syndrome. ” ... ... Act ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  29h   13  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”I highly doubt in our (America) society that the vast majority of people are undereating.” ... ... I’m talking about the vast majority of people in the AF section. ... ... ... ”So the undereating is not likely to be a cause of AF.” ... ... Then is it just merely coincidence that almost everyone in the AF section has a history of under-eating? ... ... ”And like I said before, undereating alone is probably not going to send someone into AF. Rather a combination of stress and a lot of other damaging things combined for a long period of time will send someone into AF.” ... ... Well I agree, but usually if someone is un ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  29h   10  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”This is a contradictory statement. Basically they can ”bonk” if the right condition (in your opinion) is met (infection, tumor). But stress on the other hand, according to you, they can’t ”bonk”. ” ... ... They can get physically damaged (from tumor/certain infections) and not able to perform any longer like if a runner broke their leg in a race, but I wouldn’t consider that the runner ”bonked” if they broke their leg. ... ... ... ”One subtype is called idiopathic, or of unknown cause.” ... ... As I say I’m open to ”AF”, but the overwhelming amount of evidence points to it not being real. I think the med ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  30h   23  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Being able to function trumps how quickly they can function.” ... ... You know what I was getting at, I’m more open to the adrenals not being able to keep up because the adrenals have been out-paced by the amount of stress the body is dealing with, but the adrenals are still functioning properly. ... ... Did you read the article I posted ”Have Adrenal Fatigue? No You Don’t”? The blogger talks about how hearty the adrenal glands are. ... ... http://curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=2087403 ... ... ... ... ... ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  47h   31  Adrenal Debate
     
    Yes, of course I accept chronic stress will lead to exhaustion. ... ... The crux of the debate is whether part of the reason for this is because the adrenals eventually bonk. My belief has evolved that the adrenals don’t bonk. They can get damaged from a tumor or certain infections, but otherwise they will never bonk.   [End]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  47h   37  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Its not a case of how fast they can produce hormones, its a case of CAN THEY PRODUCE AN ADEQUATE AMOUNT to maintain homeostasis.” ... ... Well that’s basically what I mean; not having the capacity in producing enough amounts fast enough. It would still mean they don’t bonk and there’s nothing wrong with the adrenals.   [End]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  49h   41  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Dude, if I eat anymore im going to pop, lol.” ... ... Oh, you meant for you! I was answering for most in the ”AF” section. I’m still not convinced you have what you think you have even if it was real, if you know what I mean! ... ... ... ”Im pretty much in agreeance with this, although not having the capacity to produce essential hormones could be interpreted as being gassed out.” ... ... I would interpret it as a car that just can’t go fast enough as needed, not that the car broke down or ran out of gas. I could concede that the car could run out of gas if someone’s under-eating because the car is sim ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  52h   50  Adrenal Debate
     
    Well it’s why I just said he’s ”skeptical” of AF. I’m pretty sure he’s more open-minded compared to most MD’s, but it’s obvious he more leans to the condition not existing and since he’s a supplement seller, I respect that he doesn’t do like other celebrity supplement-selling doctors do and jump at a chance to sell more supplements for.   [End]
     
  • Re: Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  52h   48  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Whether the adrenals can actually fatigue or not is the question, which I believe is your argument, correct?” ... ... Yes and I personally believe now that they can not fatigue. ... ... ... ”I believe, whether they are fatigued or not, they lose some ability to keep up with the demand placed on them.” ... ... Here’s what I asked in your thread and I think your answer would be yes: ... ... Have any of you thought that maybe the adrenal glands just don’t have the capacity to produce enough hormones is times of prolonged extreme stress rather than they ”gas out”? They are rather small little glands. I’m much mor ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  52h   33  Adrenal Debate
     
    I know, but his diet credibility is somewhat lost when it looks like he needs to go on a diet.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  53h   22  Adrenal Debate
     
    And I’m sure the other way around, I agree with his on his skepticism of ”AF”, but don’t totally agree with his diet. ... ... That’s why he’s still fat, the cheese!   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  53h   29  Adrenal Debate
     
    Have any of you thought that maybe the adrenal glands just don’t have the capacity to produce enough hormones is times of prolonged extreme stress rather than they ”gas out”? They are rather small little glands. I’m much more open to that, but it would still mean nothing is wrong with them.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  53h   22  Adrenal Debate
     
    Well I don’t think his diet plan is particularly high in fat. It’s just higher than what’s considered ”low-fat” which is anything 20% and under from fat, but then again if you look at him and he actually follows his diet plan, it’s obviously too high in fat!   [End]
     
  • Re: Dr. Lam proves my theory that AF is really under-eating   by natway  53h   13  Adrenal Debate
     
    Dr. Oz mentioning alternative medicine saying so-called ”AF” especially happens in women: ... ... ... Adrenal Fatigue Syndrome: A Real Medical Condition? ... ... The mainstream medical community doesn’t recognize it as a real condition, while the alternative medicine world claims it’s the reason behind an epidemic of extreme exhaustion, especially in women. ... ... http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/adrenal-fatigue-syndrome-real-medical-condition ... ... ... It especially happens in women because women especially under-eat.   [End]
     
  • Dr. Weil skeptical of AF   by natway  53h   62  Adrenal Debate
     
    Q - What’s Wrong with My Adrenals? ... I have been diagnosed with adrenal exhaustion. Is this condition very serious? How can I help my adrenals? ... ... Answer ... ... The adrenal glands sit atop the kidneys and secrete a variety of hormones including adrenaline, male sex hormones, and cortisol, a hormone produced in response to stress. Two well-known adrenal gland disorders are Cushing’s Syndrome, marked by excessive hormonal production and Addison’s disease, marked by adrenal deficiency. ... ... ”Adrenal exhaustion” and ”adrenal fatigue” are popular diagnoses among alternative medicine practitioners bu ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  54h   40  Adrenal Debate
     
    And Dr. Weil’s position on ”AF”: ... ... ... ”Adrenal exhaustion” and ”adrenal fatigue” are popular diagnoses among alternative medicine practitioners but are not recognized in conventional medicine. They are often made by people not qualified by medical training (including nutritionists, chiropractors, massage therapists and health food store clerks) and are unlikely to be valid. ... ... I’m not sure that there is any physiological basis for the notion that everyday stress can ever ”exhaust” the adrenals. Some treatments recommended for this questionable condition usually are innocuous - rest, stres ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  54h   25  Adrenal Debate
     
    haha! I actually was going to mention that too. He’s in a video I posted about fake obesity experts: ... ... http://curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=2146079 ... ... It’s why I think Weil’s diet is still too high in fat and those types of diets you have to calorie-restrict on to avoid gaining weight because it includes too much fat with carbs. Other than that, I think it’s a pretty healthy diet.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  55h   29  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Yes, I believe people can undereat and not get gassed out adrenals; if they are not dealing with a multitude of stress simultaneously.” ... ... Then that is the very reason to include a cautionary note in the ”AF” section. What if someone comes in asking for help thinking they have ”AF” when they are suffering from the effects of starvation instead? ... ... ... ”I don’t think all female models (the extremely thin ones ) all have AF, or all starving African children or any starving children for that matter. They might have nutrition deficiencies, but not AF.” ... ... How would you know? I bet if all thos ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  55h   29  Adrenal Debate
     
    To clarify, I wasn’t suggesting people just eat fruits and starches. I was just saying that’s where to get the bulk of one’s calories. ... ... If I ever thought the low-fat diet was too low in fat, I would agree too the Dr. Weil’s diet plan would probably be the one to follow.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  55h   30  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”You don’t think that it is possible for those organs to 1) give out entirely or 2) produce at a sub-optimal level because they have been damaged from years of over-production ?” ... ... I understand the logic and remember, I used to believe in ”AF”. I supposedly had ”AF” for years, but every time I got my cortisol tested, it was either normal or elevated. ... ... But here’s my problem with the ”AF” theory of over-use causing the adrenals to ”gas out”, wouldn’t people with Cushing’s disease eventually develop Addison’s disease?   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  55h   39  Adrenal Debate
     
    I’m still not seeing where Dr. Selye says what happens to the adrenals in stage 3. Do they shrink? Return to normal size? Does he even comment about the adrenals not being able to keep up with the output of cortisol needed? ... ... It looks like Dr. J. Wilson just took Dr. Selye’s GAS model and morphed it a bit. ... ... For your situation, I recommend not guessing how much you were eating, especially since you were very active doing tri’s because you’re calorie output from all our exercising could very well have been more than your calorie intake which is another form of calorie-restriction. All ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   55  Adrenal Debate
     
    Want all of your opinions on something. You know how a the top of the Water Fasting section they have a cautionary note about water fasting? ... ... Since all of you seem to agree that under-eating can cause of be a factor in you what guys think is ”AF” and the symptoms of each are the   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   49  Adrenal Debate
     
    As I said, under-eating throws off hormones, for instance, so some hormones would get raised and some lowered and some, like cortisol, would be up and down throughout the day, so to me it would be no surprise that some people would immediately feel better with taking some kind of hormone replacement, like taking synthetic thyroid medication for hypothyroid. ... ... I’m not saying you’re necessarily wrong and I understand your logic, but what if the reason that cortisol levels seem to be up and down throughout the day is because as the doctor in the article says, the adrenals are just doing what ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   47  Adrenal Debate
     
    Well you most likely wouldn’t have to get that many cals unless you’re very active, but other from fruit, I recommend you get your calories from starches like whole grains and potatoes. Legumes have a lot of calories too, but also too much protein if you base your meals around legumes IMO.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   44  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Of course you do, lol.” ... ... lol! ... ... ... ”I got better on a vegan diet (801010), but maybe problem is more digestive related. Maybe from low cortisol? ” ... ... I should have said that the ones that got sick when vegan were most likely under-eating. One did post who many cals they were getting at it was under the recommended sedentary levels. ... ... ... I’ll check out that video in a bit. ... ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   49  Adrenal Debate
     
    Curious to know, if you guys end up concluding that the adrenal glands don’t ”gas out” and therefore that ”AF” doesn’t exist then, what would you suggest the ”Adrenal Fatigue” section be renamed? ... ... Think of all the people coming in with symptoms that mostly fit the old ”AF symptoms”. Where would these new people know which section is the one for them if they don’t have a diagnosed or self-diagnosed condition? ... ... And it can’t have ”(formerly AF)” in the title! ...   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   47  Adrenal Debate
     
    I was also referring to replacement hormones along with the glandulars and herbs. If the adrenals were ”gassing out”, wouldn’t someone need to be taking cortisol? Seems like most here who tried some kind of cortisol med or supp felt too stimulated and hyper on it which tells me there adrenals are making enough cortisol. ... ... There could also be some people here with first or secondary adrenal insufficiency. I also wonder if the mega Vit C dosing also acts like a stimulant. It seems to only work for a little while in the people who get relief from it. Also want to mention that under-eati ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   78  Adrenal Debate
     
    I fully support people taking appropriate medicine (natural or pharma) if it improves the quality of their life or helps speed up the healing process, but as you eluded to, are those medicines actually helping to heal, or are they just bandaids and as soon as you stop you crash again? ... ... I personally think all those glandulars and herbs like licorice and ashwaganda are just stimulants no real better or different than coffee. I also think that’s why some people feel better after doing coffee enemas so might as well just drink it to get it in rather than get it into your body the ”alternati ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   51  Adrenal Debate
     
    I’d have to look more into what all can cause a heart attack. The heart might not be the best analogy to the adrenals because problems with the aortas of the heart and low electrolytes can cause heart attacks, but I don’t think that’s the actual heart muscles fault. ... ... I’m thinking some drugs like steroids can cause damage to the actual heart muscle, but I don’t think any recreational drugs or PEDS can physically damage the adrenal glands.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  3d   51  Adrenal Debate
     
    Answering both of you, that’s the main question and the only real difference I think in our beliefs, do the adrenals ”gas out” like the pancreas can from overuse? ... ... You guys know my position as I believe along with the medical community that the adrenal can not. The evidence that convinces me of that are ”AF” symptoms coincidentally being the same as starvation, most in the AF section under-eat, Dr. Lam admitting way more women are ”diagnosed” consistent because way more women under-eat, even Dr. L. Wilson most likely under-eat when being vegan, most people have high cortisol, and I’d al ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   52  Adrenal Debate
     
    I respect that you have a different opinion on that. ... ... You bring up something that I’ve been meaning to bring up though. I think the adrenals are like the heart, no matter how much physical excursion you put out, the heart muscle keeps going, unless you dangerously deplete yourself of electrolytes or have a building artery blockage, but that’s not the heart’s fault. At least I don’t think the heart muscle gives out, but you get my point even if it can from stress. ... ... I think that adrenals have to be physically damaged by a tumor or an infection to give out. The heart doesn’t get cancer ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   49  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”I often ponder how people are coming to the AF diagnosis.” ... ... Well I was told I had it by several alternative practitioners and since I blindly believed in holistic medicine and they had fancy degrees, I never thought to question it. I thought is was weird when one MD I saw said he didn’t even know what ”AF” was! Not it all makes sense lol. ... ... One question I’ve always had though, where does one go to get the ”official” symptoms list of so-called ”AF”? Each site that promotes ”AF” don’t all list the same symptoms, very much like the other condition of ”chronic candida” that alternative ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   45  Adrenal Debate
     
    First I want to tell you I appreciate your debating without arguing. A cure will be found faster if debate remains civil. ... ... I want to get a consensuses though because I think we are all kinda going a little bit in circles because we all agree that under-eating is a stressor and that there are many other stressors besides under-eating. ... ... The main point of the debate I’m raising about so-called ”adrenal fatigue” is are the adrenal glands actually ”fatiguing” from a great amount of stress as the proponents of the condition claim? ... ... If the adrenals aren’t affected, then do you agree all th ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   48  Adrenal Debate
     
    Well that’s the extreme form of starvation you see in the media of people who’ve been calorie-restricted for a very long time in really bad conditions, but I agree that’s what I first think of too when I hear that word and it’s why usually try and use the phrase prolonged under-eating/calorie-restriction instead to not confuse people that think you have to skin & bones and at the brink of death to be classified at suffering from starvation. ... ... You can be mentally anorexic while still obese. You just won’t be physically anorexic until your body uses up all your stored body fat and starts e ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   55  Adrenal Debate
     
    What’s your current thought at this point about adrenals supposedly being able to be impaired by stress? Why I’m so adamant against the theory of ”AF” is all the money wasted on supps that claim to rebuild adrenals when there’s nothing wrong with people’s adrenals. And who even said those supps CAN rebuild adrenals since they aren’t even clinically tested?!   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   54  Adrenal Debate
     
    Yeah, that’s why I said almost everyone in the AF section, but not everyone. ... ... This brings up a point though. I, along with the medical community, don’t believe ”AF” is real, so I think everyone in the AF section is in the wrong section! ... ... But even if ”AF” is real, how do you know you really have ”AF”? ... ... When I healed most of my problems with diet and still believed in ”AF”, I still thought I had ”AF” because I was still experiencing fatigue and at the time I didn’t even contemplate that other things might be causing my remaining fatigue, like bad sleeping habits. ... ... There’s lots of ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   47  Adrenal Debate
     
    When I say under-eating, I mean prolonged under-eating/starvation. ... ... OK, I’m agreeing with him on the adrenals aren’t the problem part! I think the only difference is he’s not investigating the root cause of what causing people’s hormone imbalances. Starvation does mess up hormone balance. ... ... ”He’s the PHD and you, to my knowledge, are not. ” ... ... But I did stay at a Holiday Inn!   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   61  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”The AF forum is full of former high energy people. They often went through periods of [not] being able to handle more stress than normal.” ... ... If I can jump in, I agree with that, but that has nothing to do with their adrenal glands, so all those ”adrenal building” supplements are a big waste of money and also diverts people from treating the real problem, like under-eating that is affecting almost everyone in the AF support section.   [End]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   65  Adrenal Debate
     
    But but, you’re ”me”. How can you disagree?! haha ... ... I kinda answered your first statement in my last post. ... ... My problem with people using anonymous #’s is some use it to attack people while hiding who they really are and also some use it to try to be more than one person. Otherwise I wouldn’t have a problem. ... ... I’ll mention again, I’m definitely not saying stress doesn’t cause health problems, but I’m just saying like the naturopath in the article you posted that stress does harm the adrenal glands. Unless stress kills you, then it harms the adrenals, along with everything else in you ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   54  Adrenal Debate
     
    See, it sounds like you’re trying to downplay under-eating when almost all in the AF section are under-eating. So many stressors out there you say can cause ”AF”, yet coincidentally almost every here complaining of ”AF” has the stressor of under-eating. Even if only a small percentage of people here were under-eating, how come so few of you are warning them about their under-eating that you agree is contributing to their illness? ... ... That kind of downplaying actually supports my evidence because denial is a big part of under-eating/eating disorders. It’s also probably a big reason I ge ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   63  Adrenal Debate
     
    You’ll have more credibility not hiding behind an anonymous #. ... ... ... ”marketing purposes...tried to capitalize on it” ... ... That should be the first clue ”AF” isn’t real. ... ... ... ... ”GAS is still in text medical texts today” ... ... Then why does the medical community dismiss ”Adrenal Fatigue” instead of saying that’s just they nickname given to GAS by holistic doctors? ... ... ... I’m not debating to try to just win an argument. I’m trying to prevent people from wasting their money treating a bogus condition and for most in the AF support section to stop under-eating. ... ... ... Isn’t quite the coincidence that a ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   79  Adrenal Debate
     
    From the article: ... ... ”There’s a lot of crap out there. Foot baths, colon cleanses, ear candling, liver/gall bladder cleanses... it’s no wonder why people question alternative medicine. Well, here’s another one: adrenal fatigue.” ... ... I’m agreeing with the naturopathic doctor so far! ... ... ... ”Dysfunctional adrenal gland physiology can cause a wide array of issues in the body that can negatively impact your training. However, it’s not really the adrenal glands that are causing the problem! The adrenal glands are merely doing what they’re told, mostly by the brain.” ... ... I agree with this too and po ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: GAS model outdated and inaccurate...   by natway  4d   68  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”The stages of GAS are exactly the same as adrenal fatigue.” ... ... Then why do some ”AF” promoting doctors and sites give more than three? ... ... Four Stages of Adrenal Fatigue ... http://www.drlam.com/articles/adrenalexhaustion.asp ... ... Seven Stages of Adrenal Issues ... http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/seven-stages/ ... ... ... That’s the problem with alternative medicine, it’s not bound by science. ... ... ... ”Then read James Wilsons book ... James Wilson simply renamed it because it was more marketable.” ... ... Or maybe he took it out of context so it can be more marketable for him to sell books and his own line of ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Dr. Atkins took 60 vitamins a day!   by natway  4d   337  Paleo Debate
     
    And low-carbers complain when plant-based eaters take just one (B12). ... ... ... Atkins’ Diet: Can We Have Our Turkey and Eat it Too? ... ... November 26, 1999 ... ... MATALIN: All right. Dr. Atkins, before we run out of time, you have been on the diet for 36 years. Do you -- is it true you take 60 vitamins a day? ... ... ATKINS: I try to. ... ... MATALIN: Why? ... ... ATKINS: I believe in vitamins. ... ... MATALIN: Well, that does not speak well for the diet if it needs to be supplemented... ... ... ATKINS: No, it speaks well for my knowledge of vitanutrients. I take them because I have learned in my study of vitanutrients how v ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  5d   50  Adrenal Debate
     
    Your posting history proves you’re totally obsessed with me: ... ... http://curezone.org/forums/s.asp?f=762&c=0&ob=d&m=%23181311 ... ... Almost every single one of your posts is about me and the couple that aren’t are to C.B. who you think is me, so that means ALL of your post are about me. Dude, you’re obsessed. Get some help for that.   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  5d   34  Adrenal Debate
     
    That’s the problem with you, Wired, you’re so carbed & calorie-deprived you can’t read correctly. I said I don’t like to, not I don’t. Since that person is not acting like a jerk, I don’t mind responding to them. ... ... Did you ask your GP about getting into an inpatient treatment program for you eating disorder? It’s the only thing that’s going to help you.   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  5d   30  Adrenal Debate
     
    I used to crave fats too (and sugar), but hardly do anymore as long as I’m eating enough on my high-carb/low-fat diet. ... ... As for plant-based diets, the biggest mistake is under-eating and it’s why I think a lot of people gravitate to wanting to eat a lot of high-fat foods, like nuts & avocados, is because their body is craving calories and fats are very calorie-dense. It’s also why a lot start craving meat after awhile. Meat is very high in calories, but unfortunately the wrong kind of calories.   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  5d   33  Adrenal Debate
     
    Thanks, I’m just sharing what I’ve learned from personal experience and from those who have shown longterm natural results. ... ... ... ”is it o.k. to take a few days and eat carbs for energy and then a few days where you eat fat or does it have to be for a long period of time?” ... ... I guess I would ask why would you want to do that?! But from what I know, seem like you have to be in ketosis to optimally get energy from fat and that will take a couple days if carb intake is low enough, so IMO going a couple days high-carb then switching a couple days high-fat would seem to be kind of extreme on yo ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  5d   38  Adrenal Debate
     
    If someone has an eating disorder, they need to also seek some type of counselling. Men can have eating disorders too, but women are more likely too than men, sadly. ... ... Diets that combine too much fat with carbs is a fattening diet and that by itself will cause eating disorders because the only way for some people to get lean on a diet like that is to calorie-restrict and or over-exercise, but there will always be consequences to that because the body doesn’t like being at a calorie deficit. No other species restricts their calories and we shouldn’t either.   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  5d   36  Adrenal Debate
     
    I’m sorry, who are you? I don’t like responding to people who hide behind their anonymous #. At least Faith is brave enough to post under her main username.   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  6d   62  Adrenal Debate
     
    Yes, it’s because of a diet with too much fat & protein added to carbs. ... ... But please change your name. Don’t stoop to the trolling levels of Shannon’s friend. We all need to stay mature around here.   [End]
     
  • Dieting Can Make You Lose Your Mind - Minnesota Starvation Experiment   by natway  6d   94  Adrenal Debate
     
    Dieting Can Make You Lose Your Mind ... ... One of the most famous calorie-restriction studies was done on conscientious objectors during World War II by Dr. Ancel Keys. 36 healthy young men who had been excused from armed service for ethical objections agreed to a year long diet of sorts. It would include 3 months of preparation, 6 months of semi-starvation (designed to make the men lose 25% of their body weight), and then 3 months of refeeding. ... ... Their average daily calories during the semistarvation period was about 1600 calories a day. I find the number 1600 calories especially compelling ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  6d   76  Adrenal Debate
     
    It’s a little funny you call others madman with the company you keep. ... ... ”Apparently he thinks that the only thing I did to get better was eat enough calories.” ... ... No, you also did one of the other things I recommend people do; eat more carbs. ... ... ”I emphasize addressing things like histamine intolerance, sodium wasting, and electrolyte imbalance played the biggest roles in my progress.” ... ... Wow, all this time I thought is was your ”10 years of yo-yo dieting, an eating disorder and over exercise” because of your ”obsessive efforts to stay thin and trim” that was doing you in, but I guess it ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Amy Winehouse & Peaches Geldof died from Eating Disorders   by natway  8d   518  Fasting: Deb.
     
    Even though drugs and alcohol may have been a factor, sadly it looks like anorexia and bulimia contributed in the deaths of both Amy Winehouse (27) and Peaches Geldof (25). ... ... ... Amy Winehouse ... http://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/jun/23/amy-winehouse-bulimia-killed-her-says-brother ... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1184654/Drinking-anorexia-family-turmoil-Documentary-charts-shocking-deterioration-Amy-Winehouse.html ... ... ... Peaches Geldof ... http://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/peaches-geldof-dead-eating-disorder-3390376 ... http://www.smh.com.au/comment/peaches-geldofs-life-not- ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  9d   107  Adrenal Debate
     
    You’re welcome that my advice of carbing up and getting enough calories was what finally started getting you better.   [End]
     
  • Re: Bannanas   by natway  10d   68  Adrenal Debate
     
    They sure are, Mikey: ... ... ... wiredgeneration ... Date: 4/6/2014 12:40:02 PM ... Natway believes you can cure cancer with bannanas. ... ... ... #181311 (wiredgeneration’s anonymous #) ... Date: 4/6/2014 12:01:08 PM ... Now runalong fruit boy, go eat your sugar and fix cancer with bannanas! ... ... ... #181311 (wiredgeneration’s anonymous #) ... Date: 4/2/2014 12:00:38 PM ... Nates in Love. And its not with a bannana. ... ... ... 155216 (wiredgeneration’s original account) ... Date: 2/4/2014 5:55:13 AM ... He also believes cancer can be cured by eating 30 bannanas a day apparently. Gotta love the crazies. ... ... ... 155216 (wiredgeneration’s o ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  10d   101  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”his crusade of disrespect to others with his pathetic threads on here.” ... ... ... Wired’s post and conversation not too long ago (before he went back and edited original post to try to cover his tracks): ... ... ... I dont believe AF actually exists really.. ... PM wiredgeneration ... Date: 8/28/2013 12:07:48 PM ... AF dosent exist, its that simple. ... AF was a cunning ploy by ND’s to capitalise on an area of medicine that was not understood or acknowledged, ... ... ... Re: I dont believe AF actually exists really.. ... PM eddie57 ... Date: 8/28/2013 1:52:02 PM ... Opinions vary. You sound like a person in the medical professi ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  10d   115  Adrenal Debate
     
    #181311 ... Date: 4/6/2014 4:02:37 AM ... ”I agree with the OP. AF is General Adaptation Syndrome.” ... ... natway ... Date: 4/6/2014 11:08:57 AM ... ”Of course you agree with the op, ur him, Mikey.” ... ... #181311 ... Date: 4/6/2014 12:01:08 PM ... ”So you keep saying...*sigh* gets dull, don’t you get bored? but it entertains me, and one day ill post with my username and poor you will look even sillier. ... Now runalong fruit boy, go eat your sugar and fix cancer with bannanas!” ... ... wiredgeneration ... Date: 4/6/2014 12:40:02 PM ... ”Natway believes you can cure cancer with bannanas.” ... ... ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - Its 3/4 Stages - NEW VISITORS LOOK ...   by natway  10d   89  Fight Club
     
    ”bannanas” ... ... I didn’t catch that. Thanks!   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - General Adaptation Syndrome   by natway  10d   91  Adrenal Debate
     
    Fruit Loops wasn’t the real problem. It was the milk people combined with it that turned the sugar into poison. ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - Its 3/4 Stages - NEW VISITORS LOOK ...   by natway  11d   103  Fight Club
     
    You apparently don’t get bored of lying & trying to deceive people, like a true troll, but if you’re going to try to keep hiding yourself like a coward, don’t say I think bananas cure cancer under your anonymous #181311 number and then go over to the AF support section and post the same thing under your ’wiredgeneration’ username. Things like that will give you away. ... ... And to cure your delusion that I think AF is malaria, get fully carbed up and read the first three sentences of this post that you obviously missed: ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - Its 3/4 Stages - NEW VISITORS LOOK ...   by natway  11d   116  Fight Club
     
    Of course you agree with the op, ur him, Mikey. You’re not fooling anyone. You were doing so well posting as your main name (wiredgeneration). Guess you felt ”TOLD” and had to come in as your anonymous # as some sort of lame backup. I suggest you get some help if you can’t act mature and rational and accept that people may have different opinions than you. In the meantime, carb up.   [End]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - Its 3/4 Stages - NEW VISITORS LOOK ...   by natway  12d   100  Adrenal Debate
     
    Why? You’ll just edit your old posts to try to cover up and deceive people when others try to show your hypocrisy of blasting others for thinking AF doesn’t exist, but you once said the very same thing. You can screengrab all my posts because I don’t go back to try to cover my tracks like you do. ... ... I also recommend you try to get plenty of calories each and every day because being anorexic will cause your brain a lot of confusion from being so depleted of fuel and that will cause you to incorrectly interpret what a lot of what people say, like thinking I think ”AF” is now malaria from me ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • Re: What Adrenal Fatigue Really Is - Its 3/4 Stages - NEW VISITORS LOOK ...   by natway  12d   120  Adrenal Debate
     
    ”Adrenal Fatigue” is really prolonged under-eating/anorexia. The info posted and the op’s own history proves this: ... ... ... ”General adaptation syndrome, or GAS, is a term used to describe the body’s short-term and long-term reactions to stress. ... Stressors in humans include such physical stressors as starvation, being hit by a car, or suffering through severe weather. ... ... Stage 2 might also be named the stage of adaptation, instead of the stage of resistance. During this phase, if the stress continues, the body adapts to the stressors it is exposed to. Changes at many levels take place in ord ...   [retrieve this message]
     
  • The 3 stages of AF   by natway  12d   52  Adrenal Debate
     
    STAGE 1: Calorie-restricting a little bit. ... ... STAGE 2: Calorie-restricting a lot. ... ... STAGE 3: Full-blown anorexia. ... ... ... Learn what ”AF”   [End]
     
  • Re: Sweden Recommends Low-Carb, High Fat Diet.   by natway  14d   85  Adrenal Debate
     
    I believe low-fat diets didn’t work because 1) people simply weren’t eating low-fat enough and 2) most common mistake with a low-fat diet is under-eating. ... ... Just like with low-carb, you have to be low-fat enough, or it won’t work. I have a relative who says he eats ”low-fat”, but I’ve seen how he eats. He might be eating lower-fat compared to what he used to eat, but trust me, he’s not eating ”low-fat”. ... ... McDougall wrote an article about this, but kind find it at the moment.   [End]
     
  • Re: Sweden Recommends Low-Carb, High Fat Diet.   by natway  14d   59  Adrenal Debate
     
    One person here thinks we should all be on a RAW paleo diet and thinks we are only supposed to poop a couple times a week. Another victim of Paleo propaganda. ... ... I posted some videos of how a too much fat mixed with carbs is what really causes diabetes: ... ... http://curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2152655#i ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: Sweden Recommends Low-Carb, High Fat Diet.   by natway  15d   127  Adrenal Debate
     
    Let’s talk about internet obsession, Mikey. ... ... In your 13 posts so far under your new anonymous #, every single one of your posts you are responding to me: ... ... http://curezone.org/forums/s.asp?f=762&c=0&ob=d&m=%23181311 ... ... That’s pretty freaky. I recommend you get some help for your obsession with me. ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: Sweden Recommends Low-Carb, High Fat Diet.   by natway  15d   84  Adrenal Debate
     
    wiredgeneration ... Date: 8/3/2013 12:12:19 PM ... ”I was definitely undereating which brought me into the AF world..I was training to much and eating literally nothing.” ... ... wiredgeneration ... Date: 8/28/2013 12:07:48 PM ... ”I dont believe AF actually exists really.. ... AF dosent exist, its that simple. ... AF was a cunning ploy by ND’s to capitalise on an area of medicine that was not understood or acknowledged,” ... ... wiredgeneration ... Date: 1/8/2014 6:52:36 AM ... ”even spending time in Costa Rica with Graham? Boom.” ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: All who got sick when Vegan under-ate   by natway  15d   64  Adrenal Debate
     
    Mikey, stop the lying. You’re not fooling anybody. ... ... The first posts from your new wiredgeneration account and that accounts anonymous #: ... ... #181311 ... Date: 3/7/2014 12:24:49 PM ( 26d ago ) ... http://curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2156608 ... ... wiredgeneration ... Date: 3/7/2014 12:53:38 PM ( 26d ago ) ... http://curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2156619 ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: Sweden Recommends Low-Carb, High Fat Diet.   by natway  15d   83  Adrenal Debate
     
    Looks like Sweden is going to need a lot of supplements to counter the toxic effects of their new recommended diet! ... ... If that diet is so good, why are most people at this forum who are on a low-carb diet not getting better? ... ... Biggest diet culprits: under-eating & low-carb ...   [End]
     
  • Re: All who got sick when Vegan under-ate   by natway  15d   40  Adrenal Debate
     
    Careful, Wired is gonna call you a troll for not agreeing with him 100%.   [End]
     
  • Re: All who got sick when Vegan under-ate   by natway  15d   41  Adrenal Debate
     
    I guess I can say you and Wired are two peas in a pod too. Both with ED backgrounds who complain about trolls the most, yet have become the biggest trolls here. It’s very sad, actually. ... ... Glad you recognize calorie-restriction was a big cause of your health problems, but why are you still blaming your past vegan diet when you were under-eating on it? ... ... I promote a plant-based diet. Whether one wants to be vegan most of the week, or fully vegan, that’s up to them. ... ... ...   [End]
     
  • Re: Wired AF debate with C.b.   by natway  15d   44  Adrenal Debate
     
    Tell Dr. Graham too the next time you go on your fake fasting retreat with him.   [End]
     
  • Re: Wired AF debate with C.b.   by natway  15d   49  Adrenal Debate
     
    Mikey, why ur talking in the 3rd person? You’re not fooling anyone. At least Faith is brave enough to troll in her name. You have to hide behind your anonymous # that you complain others of doing. ... ... Your first posts of your new account: ... ... #181311 ... Date: 3/7/2014 12:24:49 PM ( 26d ago ) ... http://curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2156608 ... ... wiredgeneration ... Date: 3/7/2014 12:53:38 PM ( 26d ago ) ... http://curezone.org/forums/fm.asp?i=2156619   [End]
     
  • Re: Wired AF debate with C.b.   by natway  15d   63  Adrenal Debate
     
    Where’s the high-carb, anonymous # person? ...   [End]
     
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