Interesting website worth a read.. 
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Is it that real AF is actually M.E or that M.E is actually A.F?
Lots of talk to adrenal function further down this page on the ink. However the diagnosis page talks that M.E can be correctly diagnosed with Spect and Xenon Spect scans of the brain, has anyone ever had these during their searches for whats wrong?
http://www.hfme.org/adrenalinesurgetips.htm
Would love to hear some thoughts...- Re: Interesting website worth a read... Faith110
11 y
1,833
MoreThis is a reply to # 2,035,320The last time I was in the hospital they did about 15 different scans, including Spect, on my head. I went in for what they thought was a stroke, but turned out to be a wacky combination of a migraine, sodium loss, and the orthostatic hypotension all working together in a disastrous symphony LOL.
They found nothing wrong with my brain. No lesions or growths. I don't think it's a safe bet to say that AF is the same thing as ME. I'm sure that the adrenals are eventually impaired by ME (or any other degenerative disease) for the simple fact that the body is under such duress trying to maintain homeostasis. It seems to me that AF is always the icing on the cake when the body just can't handle any more stress.
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... 155216
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This is a reply to # 2,035,452Advertisement
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”This program is probably one of the best on the market, especially for the price.”
Yes I totally see what you mean, I keep forgetting AF is the end or contributing factor to an underlying problem. The syptoms will so many illness seem to mirror each other, no wonder half of us never get to the root of the problem!
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
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This is a reply to # 2,035,752Hi Mikey,
I've done couple of tests with the guy you recommend me in UK and the conclusion is that my AF is caused for sure by underlying problem + my mental stress in the past.
These tests discovered:
- heave bacterial infection in gastrointestinal system (although I am not facing any bloating, cramp. I would never say I have this problem...)
- parasites
- dental infection in root canal
- wrong liver detoxification
- weak pancreas function
- very low HCL in stomach
- protein digestion trouble
And the final result is AF confirmed by saliva tests and all my symptomps. I was trying nearly 1 year to get rid of AF symptoms just by supporting adrenals. But it is not working so far. Answer can be the underlying problems in my body.
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... 155216
11 y
1,850
MoreThis is a reply to # 2,035,760Hey dude
Thats great news, well not great, but finding out lots of things wrong is a real positive start, im glad he has been of help! Good luck with your recovery!!
How much did it cost you to get to that point? I havent been able to contact David again as money is a massive issue for me at the moment, but would love to hear what his repair protocol is like, what supplements and what he thinks recovery looks like etc.
Im currently off Dr Lams supplements, and on a basic NB one while my hair test is off, but ive gotten to much worse, im pretty much bed bound suffering intense hour long adrenaline surges and muscle cramping, nauceasu, extreme fatigue all day long. Doing anything more staying and bed and basic household chores makes it much much worse, sad times.
just trying to get an idea on what avenue to go with with my last remaining pounds. The NB diet is killing me and really cant be healthy!Advertisement
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
11 y
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This is a reply to # 2,035,765Hi Mikey,
I paid for the tests about 700USD + express delivery from Europe to US.
I've been studying Ray Peat work which was mentioned by Klauss here in curezone and also by David. Couple weeks ago I was facing mild reactive hypo. I started to sip during whole day diluted orage juice with salt and collagen 1/3. I think I feel better. I have constant energy/sugar level during day.
I was afraid of potassium and Sugar in orage juice but as I am only sipping diluted juice with salt and collagen, it is ok. In last 2 weeks I don't have reactive hypo. I find it interesting. I am not sure whether it is caused by the juice, but anyway good progress on my side.
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... lalobear
11 y
1,965
This is a reply to # 2,035,765Mikey,
It may not be the NB diet that is killing you. You said you are not taking Dr. Lams supps anymore...coming off those cold turkey may present symptoms for you in many degrees.
What exactly are you eating?
I run into problems if I eat the wrong things even on the NB diet. For example the NB diet encourages lots of veggies...well I did that only I was eating broccoli and cabbage everyday ..all day...until the cows came home. I did not realize that these two veggies are brassiacs and too much of this good thing could interfere with your thyroid.
Well I was starting to have symptoms I didn't have before like insane dry eyes and mouth at night, body temp problems, just not feeling good to add to all my other AF symptoms. I backed off those veggies for awhile and those symptoms disappeared.
I can still eat broccoli and cabbage but I just have to rotate my veggies all the time rather than eating the same thing everyday.
Also starting this diet so abruptly can cause detox and mineral shifting and make you feel sooooo much worse at first. Many have reported this.
I really hate that this is so complicated and so very difficult for many to find the right healing path with AF.
I am so sad that you had to sell your guitar. My hope for you is that you will recover and be able to buy another one.Advertisement
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... Faith110
11 y
1,822
This is a reply to # 2,035,837Lalobear,
As long as you weren't eating the brassicas raw then they would not inhibit thyroid function. However, both broccoli and cabbage are both very high in potassium, which could have been why they were causing you problems. Those in extreme exhaustion have sodium/potassium issues.
And I agree, too much of anything is never good. A Rotation Diet is always best. - Re: Interesting website worth a read... 155216
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This is a reply to # 2,035,837Hey Lalobear,
I reduced Lams vitamins over time to be honest...from the megadosing in the summer, to reducing them step by step over the next months..I was down to 1 x lipo c, 1 x glut, which ive now stopped and havent actually seen a slight improvement since stopping them.But you're right, coming off any intensive ingestion of something can cause withdrawals! On the third week of nicotine withdrawals to, so im sure thats just adding to the misery even though i dont crave one. Im on a basic multi-vit at the moment, very similar to the NB endo one, but I had it in, so it didnt cost anything.
I have been eating ALOT of broccoli and cabbage since December, you are definitely right. I work on cabbage, broccali, chicken, peas, brown rice, quinoa, onions,rice and buckwheat porridge,almond milk, almond butter...occasional steak..cant really eat eggs as they make my kidney stone hurt like a knife being inserted. I have just started the carrot juicing and dont seem to be having any hypo reactions which i used to get when i tried it, so that is cool. The biggest problem is just to afford vegetables and meat etc on this level im running in to £80-£100 a week on food, its unsustainable :( cabbage and broccoli last a while, are quite bulky and easy to make as I cant stand up for long,plus my kitchen is downstairs so just getting up and down is exhausting and kicks off an adrenaline surge and crash...grr, such a nightmare, but I will try my utomost to come up with an alternative plan to rotate them more with other things.
I did have my thyroid checked a few weeks ago and it was normal but I know the majority of us work on a subclinical impairment which the medical fraternity dosent register. Its just difficult as being in the UK, we dont get a huge range of vegetables at all...I remember going to Wholefoods in San Fran years ago and seeing the massive range of things the states gets! Its also winter so root vegetables are a mass..whats the sort of things you munch if you dont mind me asking? Im just worried about the weight loss, im eating as much as I can, which is lots but its just falling off..and according to my urine test im entering that state where your body eats itself (lots of protien in my pee) Chacolism or something?
I dont think its quite sunk in my black Martin is not going to be around much longer, its like the only thing that keeps me sane! but I sold the tv to pay the rent...oh im such a sob story! The only thing that keeps me going is hoping one day I can buy a new one and do a road trip through the South states in the sunshine, I have always knowI was born on the wrong continent :)
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
11 y
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This is a reply to # 2,035,852Advertisement
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hi wired,
question 1: how long have you been taking lam's supplements? did you feel some improvement after them ? what about the gluthatione?
question 2: are you able to eat these having no problems ?rice,peas,quinoa and buckwheat,almond milk, almond butter...i mean you dont have carbs digestion issues or bacterial overgrowth ?
this one is new for me I never heard it.must be very painfull..."cant really eat eggs as they make my kidney stone hurt like a knife being inserted."
hm,
dave
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- Wired generation lalobear
11 y
2,070
This is a reply to # 2,035,852Hi Mikey,
You sound like such a nice fellow. My heart goes out to you as I know what it is like to be in the depths of despair with health issues. I used to get terrible adrenaline surges day and night until I reduced the amount of carbs I was eating and increased the amount of protein along with veggies. It sounds like such a minor thing but made a huge difference for me with the adrenaline rushes. Turns out I have a very low tolerance to carbs right now with my poor adrenal function. The hair test told me this thankfully. A least one problem solved.
Exactly how much carbs are you consuming every day? How much protein everyday? Very important if you are carb intolerant!! I had a terrible time putting on weight until I got these amounts right. And don't go overboard with the protein either....that can put you into catabolic wasting too believe it or not .....started to happen to me until I realized I was eating WAY too much chicken at one point. There are some simple calculations you can do to get the exact amounts for your weight. I can give them to you if you are interested. Are you hypoglycemic at all?
When you get your haif test back I urge you to post your results on the Nutritional balancing forums. There are some very knowledgable people there who have been through hell and back with this. Facebook has an EXCELLENT group where it is more conversational. I have made some good friends there who were in terrible shape and are healing. They have also started a new forum you will see mentioned in that Facebook Nutritional Balancing group. Plus on Facebook we all use our real names like you mentioned and you see our picture. Much more personal. Anyway you are probsbly sleeping right now..if you are in the UK so I will sign off for now.
- Re: Wired generation 155216
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This is a reply to # 2,036,018Hey lalobear,
Thanks for writing...I am eating carbs, although not excessively to be honest. Quinoa (which isnt strictly a carb) and brown rice and only really one meal a day with them. I had no carbs for the entire of December and half of January, but it made little difference to the adrenaline surges and exhausted me ten fold.Ill try and back down on them and see if it helps...im 6ft 4" and dropping weight like there is no tomorrow, its difficult to keep up the calorie count, and also afford to do so! I try to eat either a chicken breast a day, occasionally a steak..I have to avoid eggs as they flare up the massive kidney stone I have and strangely do seem to initiate a violent crash so im thinking I have some intolerence. Its all such guess work isnt it? Im trying to learn what I am meant to be eating, but I barely have enough energy to make anything, so generally it just all goes in a pot, i boil it up and then eat it but any help with weights and amounts would be a great great help.
Which facebook forum is it? I could only see one, but only has around 100members? is that it?
My understanding of hypoglycemia was that i used to have it...getting extremely spaced or tired after eating sugar? I dont have that so much now...I notice it when I am violently crashing and have to have some chocolate or something just to make it bearable, dont get spaced or tired..i know its counter-productive and a silly thing to do but sometimes the pain is worse than the aftermath.
Sleep? whats that?! :)
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- Re: Wired generation lalobear
11 y
1,860
This is a reply to # 2,036,068hi Wired,
You're 6'4"? Wow! Well you need a lot of calories!
As for protein to calculate how much a person with adrenal burnout should ideally consume: Divide your weight in pounds by 2.2 to get the kilograms. Or if you know the kilograms then just multiply your weight in kg first by 1 and then by 1.25 and that will give you how much protein you should eat in grams. If you want it in ounces than divide the grams by 7.
For amount of carbs you need to eat at least 3 meals a day that have 25 g of carb each or maybe a little more because of your height and 2 20g carb snacks per day. As your metabolism heals you should increase that to 30-35g of carb per meal.
Anyway the bottom line is you need good calories. Carbs I would say up to 150 g a day for your frame.
Never eat a carb alone. Always have it with a bit of protein and maybe small amt of fat.
I know this sounds a bit kookoo and some will say oh just eat and you'll be fine. Well anyone with adrenal problems know that eating can be far from simple and downright complicated and even stressful.
Eating too few carbs increases adrenaline/cortisol levels. Eating too many carbs increases insulin levels and will cause storage of fat which may be desirable for you but it might also set off adrenaline if you don't balance it out with protein and maybe a bit of fat......EXHAUSTING!!!!
Despite how annoying this way of eating has been...sticking to it as closely as possible has eliminated my adrenaline rushes and I am able to sleep better.
What you eat before bed matters too. What do you eat before you try to go to sleep?
Anyway, healing is complicated but I'm glad you are waiting for another hair analysis. Yes I think you were looking at the right facebook forum. I believe it has just over 100 members. Pippa is the moderator. I think you will like it esp if you are doing the NB program.- Re: Wired generation 155216
11 y
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This is a reply to # 2,036,106Thanks Lalobear, this is amazingly helpful...im around 80kg give or take, so it means i need to be consuming 100grammes of protien a day? This dosent seem a lot,but to be honest, ie never measured food out or cooked properly, so this will be a learning curve. Its almost impossible at the moment as I can barely get up, but ill try and do some bedside measurements for when I do cook. I just wish I didnt have this huge kidney stone (which funnily appeared after going on the NB diet), as I love eggs, and they are easy but they make it go berzerk on the pain scale...Im trying to eat large vegetable meals but I just dont have the energy and they wipe me out.Its at the point where I have to look at the fork and really convince myself to use that last bit of energy to eat that next bit and then experience the crash that will follow. Sorry state of affairs. When does ones energy ever come back?
Ive been on a rough version of the NB diet now for over two months, and I have to admit, I feel the worse I ever have done in my life. Adrenaline and anxiety are through the roof
I've joined the forum and will say hello shortly.."Hi im Mikey, im truly broken " :)Advertisement
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- Re: Wired generation 155216
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- Re: Wired generation lalobear
11 y
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... Faith110
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
11 y
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
11 y
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This is a reply to # 2,035,760Hi Halam
I'm in a similar sitution with similar problems. my eternal question - treating AF is it enough? when to start parasites bacteria cleansing so not making AF worst.
I bet there should be a balanced approach one infection at the time as soon as adrenals are better. but still confused...dr.wilson diet helps but not too much ...
I wrote before - my experiences with alternative practitioners in UK were positive but incomplete. maybe just my luck.
anyway i obtained much more than in my country but somehow you feel something is missing and cannot get through
Onwards suggested fixing the adrenals first in order to be strong enough to start cleanse. She started by cleansing first and told was very hard for her.
I would be interested to see what your practititoner recommended for you.
I'm also interested to have my root canals solved (have 2) but afraid of doing it now. They should take out my teeth also. Not very knowledgeable dentist here. and I dont want Antibiotics anymore.
dave
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... 155216
11 y
1,750
This is a reply to # 2,035,778I did a month long Candida cleanse, and made myself a lot lot worse in the process. Probably didnt even sort the Candida out, and it was reletively gentle with the diet, Candex and a colonic before and after...helped with constipation but knocked me out completely..
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
11 y
1,774
This is a reply to # 2,035,793So basically
there is some truth in that - cleanse can make you bedridden if adrenals and liver not ok.
wired what detox ways were you using during the cleanse?
skin brush, enemas, ....
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
11 y
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- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
11 y
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This is a reply to # 2,035,778Advertisement
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I have to say I am really impressed by David's knowledge.
I think my biggest problem is digestion and infection which was also confirmed by tests and also poor mental stress handling.
For example I tried to take HCL and digestive enzymes (NOW brand) but after couple days I was always feeling much worse. I had stomach pain and generally I felt worse.
I thought when someone has infection in stomach, HCL/enzymes can cause no harm. But it is not true. Actually it can make things worse and now I am not allowed to take it.
I obtained very detailed 4 pages long protocol for mucosal barrier correction, pathogen elimination from GI, Anti-fungal protocol.
Because my liver is not detoxing very well, I am on liver support (NAC, taurine, l-glutathione, methionine).
I also use Collagen 1 and 3.
I did a lot of trial and errors in the past with herbs and adrenal cortex with bad result. After reading dr. Lam book and all experiences here in curezone I am using only gentle support for adrenals.
I will let you know more next week. I will get my adrenal protocol and combination with G1 Protocol.
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
11 y
1,715
This is a reply to # 2,035,812Halam,
thanks for your opinion I dont think so about me sorry :). I'm struggling and try to learn as much as I can from other people and net.
but here are my thoughts about last message: read but hink with your mind and experiences:
- try with less quantity of enzymes; sometimes too much in the system could be overwhelming
- some enzymes with some condition make the condition worst. for me with giardia BILE is not ok at all so i'm taking just proteolithic. better
- HCL sometimes could make SIBO worst; try again separately.
- ingridients and strengh make a lot of difference - HCL from Source Naturals is not ok for me (it contains milk). - try less separately and see
- do try to see if you dont have Hpilory. its a common infection in the stomach and also in the small intestine
- test and retest foods and supplements is the only way. try less, separately with different food.
i would really be interested about your reaction to NAC, gluthatione...I was having very bad reaction and cant figured why. could be mercury...or gelatine in it or i dont know. please write your feedback after trying them and what brand were you using.
what is your opinionn about dr.lam book. some said its really good? is more than his website?
dave
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
11 y
1,955
This is a reply to # 2,035,817Advertisement
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Hi Dave505,
I've confused you little bit with the name "David". Mikey mentioned this name at the beginning of this message. David is a health practitioner in UK. I was answering you but also little bit reacted to Mikey message and I mentioned David's name. Sorry for confusion.
I like the book from dr. Lam, it helped me understand a lot of problems. I've not read the web pages so I can't compare.
Fortunatelly I have no problem with NAC, gluthatione.
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... dave505
11 y
1,875
This is a reply to # 2,035,825ok Halam,
Now make sense :) with the name.
What brands are you using for NAC and gluthatione. is your gluthatione liposomal?. ive heard there is also a cream with gluthatione.My NAC was from Biotics Research and contained gelatine. I'm trying to figure out if NAC was a problem or gelatine?- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
11 y
1,902
This is a reply to # 2,035,830I am using this one:
http://www.health-energy-fitness.co.uk/The-Shop/Support-Liver?man=0&type=0&se...
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... halam
11 y
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This is a reply to # 2,035,320Very interesting. I mirror these M.E symptoms almost exactly, right down to the tell-tale lupus-like rash on my face in the shape of a butterfly. I tested negative for lupus, so I never approached it again. Another huge one is the alcohol, medicine, food intolerance with hypoglycemic-like episodes. Even the throat gland swelling. This is me to a T.
- Re: Interesting website worth a read... Faith110
11 y
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